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WranglerFiat Diesel Being Testing for 2012 Wrangler?
Posted by mike on 2010/12/21 10:13:53 (4600) reads

In their Upcoming Changes in the Chrysler, Dodge, and Jeep Lineup report, Allpar.com indicates that Fiat may be testing a diesel engine for the U.S. version 2012 Wrangler:

Fiat diesels will eventually power some Chrysler vehicles (possibly including Jeeps currently VM-powered), in export markets; however VM Motori continues to hold sway. The 4.5 Cummins QSB four cylinder is rumored to have high power but again, emissions are an issue for US sale. A Fiat diesel is reportedly being tested by Siemens for US certification in the 2012 Wrangler.

The entire report is quite fascinating - check it out.

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myhotwheels22981
Posted: 2011/1/8 3:30  Updated: 2011/1/8 3:30
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Joined: 2002/3/22
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Posts: 247
 Re: Fiat Diesel Being Testing for 2012 Wrangler?
Why not just go Reformer-Fuel Cell?

Fiat already has a NUVERA R/FC Panda concept that converts nearly any liquid fuel to Hydrogen, and Hydrogen to electricity...Hub mounted motors and a decent sized battery pack to eliminate the Transmission, Transfer Case and Driveshafts...

The so-called Hydrogen economy will never fuel cars completely...at best a small hydrogen tank in combination with a fuel cell will act as a 'Battery' for 30 or 40 miles battery range, but to exclusively fuel a car with H2 means that the more hydrogen you need to carry, the bigger the car needs to be...The bigger the car needs to be, the more H2 it needs to carry, and so on and so forth...

America would be best served by converting all of the non-human consumable corn into Ethanol by destarching, converting all of the U.S. Agricultural Waste into Ethanol/Biodiesel, converting all of the U.S. garbage waste into Ethanol/Biodiesel, Growing dedicated crops to produce Biofuel, including non-THC producing Hemp-type plants (marigolds will work well), AND converting refining space to Bio-Algae producing plants....

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MarkH
Posted: 2011/1/5 7:40  Updated: 2011/1/5 7:40
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Joined: 2005/7/20
From: The Great White North
Posts: 494
 Re: Fiat Diesel Being Testing for 2012 Wrangler?
Latest diesel rumor from Jp Magazine:

"Not for North America (yet?):
Turbodiesel for the Liberty/[Grand] Cherokee/Wrangler... a 2.8L worth 200 horses and 302 lb-ft of torque for the Wranglers with the six-speed manual, 339 lb-ft with the five-speed automatic... the Compass and Patriot will get a 2.2L turbodiesel that makes 163 hp ...and 236 lb-ft of torque..."

They still gotta pass the more stringent U.S. emissions requirements... so chances are these engines will be introduced overseas first...

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xjgary
Posted: 2011/1/7 13:34  Updated: 2011/1/7 13:34
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Posts: 91
 Re: Fiat Diesel Being Testing for 2012 Wrangler?
On another list, populated mostly by Jeep employees, they were talking about a slightly larger Fiat diesel engine that made 250 HP and something like 400 ft pounds of torque. But when they had Siemens's run the tests for smog, durability and maintainability it failed. But that means they go back and tweak some things, as it already passed the Euro 5 standard. Then it has to pass the Govt test.

Porsche just ran a TV ad saying they were coming out with a super fast hybrid that uses electric motors in the wheel hubs and gets 75 mpg. This is the future. I suspect that means the first 40 miles is run on battery followed by the gas engine kicking in to get an average of 75 MPG, but that's still OK.

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MarkH
Posted: 2010/12/24 6:46  Updated: 2010/12/24 6:49
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Joined: 2005/7/20
From: The Great White North
Posts: 494
 Re: Fiat Diesel Being Testing for 2012 Wrangler?
JEEZ, guys!? I think we should be pretty tickled that we're finally getting a Pentastar with 260-290HP and some decent torque!

If we get a US-emissions approved diesel, all the better!!

As for brand new, pricey, complex, alternative drivetrains with questionable reliability (and impossible on the trail "fixability"... gee, is that a word?)... I'm GLAD they're not yet slated for a Jeep Wrangler...

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xjgary
Posted: 2010/12/24 12:58  Updated: 2010/12/24 12:58
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 Re: Fiat Diesel Being Testing for 2012 Wrangler?
MarkH:
We're dreaming about what the future will hold. For now I'd be delighted with a diesel engine and a drivetrain that won't break under the strain of all that torque. But when Jeep was working on the ENVI project, in-hub electric motors was a future consideration. Several other car companies are working on this, as 1/3 of your power is lost through the drivetrain and it accounts for a great deal of dead weight. Think diesel locomotive. In 2020 there is another federal requirement to meet regarding fuel mileage where it steps up again. I see it as a plus if it's done right. There have been many breakthroughs in electric motors in the last few years. Even airplanes can be powered with them for 2 hour joy rides.

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MarkH
Posted: 2010/12/26 18:09  Updated: 2010/12/26 18:15
Home away from home
Joined: 2005/7/20
From: The Great White North
Posts: 494
 Re: Fiat Diesel Being Testing for 2012 Wrangler?
I understand your points...

Looking at JEEP Wrangler's playbook, since 1991... there is a definite methodical pattern...

From the 4.0L, 3.8L, and now the new 3.6L... Jeep hasn't introduced "new" powertrain systems in the Wrangler, first. Too much at stake.

For example, the GC got the 3.6 first, and it should. Then, there's time to work out any minor bugs, and Wrangler gets it. That suits me!

Even with the lethargic 3.8L, at least they had a zillion mile history in the minivans, first... So it had few issues in the JK.

I just want reliability to be the very FIRST priority. And cost a close second...

Poster Thread
MarkH
Posted: 2010/12/23 5:53  Updated: 2010/12/23 5:54
Home away from home
Joined: 2005/7/20
From: The Great White North
Posts: 494
 Re: Fiat Diesel Being Testing for 2012 Wrangler?
Truely an automotive cornicopea of power, reliability...
WOW!! FIAT's reputation has come a long way since it stood for "Fix It Again Tony"!

Let's hope you are correct, Josephus!

Poster Thread
dyg
Posted: 2010/12/23 2:39  Updated: 2010/12/23 2:40
Just popping in
Joined: 2006/4/28
From: Metro Atlanta, GA, USA
Posts: 11
 Re: Fiat Diesel Being Testing for 2012 Wrangler?
I'd hate to be disappointed again. First the VM Motori didn't make it to the states, then the ENVI program got canceled/delayed. Hopefully Fiat comes thru.

I'd like a Volt-like powertrain on my Jeep with a diesel ICE for the extended range.

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xjgary
Posted: 2010/12/23 13:27  Updated: 2010/12/23 13:27
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 Re: Fiat Diesel Being Testing for 2012 Wrangler?
They even talked about using 4 wheel hub motors that would do away with the power robbing drivetrain and weight of axles, transmission and transfer case. Of course now you have unsprung weight in the wheels that messes with handling, but new electric motor technology makes lighter motors. Then you have greatly improved undercarriage clearance. It would be like having portal axles.

I had two Fiats in my youth. The first was a 128 sedan that I drove across Canada and the US with no problems whatsoever. While we were waiting for a stoplight a pickup truck plowed into us going 45 or 50 MPH. We all walked away w/o injury. The next was a 124 sedan. I drove it 14 years and sold it for what I paid for it. It never had to be towed home at least.

Poster Thread
xjgary
Posted: 2010/12/22 11:28  Updated: 2010/12/22 11:28
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Joined: 2005/7/25
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Posts: 91
 Re: Fiat Diesel Being Testing for 2012 Wrangler?
Oh that would be soooo sweet! Hopefully they will also build a Jeep pickup and this engine will be offered. Somewhere I read that Fiat has a 250 HP clean diesel with a ton of torque. I suspect having a drivetrain that can handle all that torque will be an issue to be dealt with.

Poster Thread
Josephus
Posted: 2010/12/23 1:29  Updated: 2010/12/23 1:29
Home away from home
Joined: 2005/7/18
From: Pennsylvania
Posts: 265
 Re: Fiat Diesel Being Testing for 2012 Wrangler?
YES! ! !
I am so gonna buy one of these US diesel Wranglers when they come out.
Have you read the 5 year plan? I am amazed at the total number of companies Fiat holds.
Fiat, Lancia, Chrysler, Dodge, Iveco, Jeep, Maserati and Ferrari... and they are working with Cummins, Dana, and ZF.
Think of all the areas of expertise and awesome vehicles in these names. Truely an automotive cornicopea of power, reliability, traction, and agility.
I knew Cerebus wasn't going to amount to much, I had high hopes for Daimler-Mercedes, but it seems like Fiat may actually understand what the quintessential Jeep customer wants as an option...multiple engines and fuel choices.
There is really no reason for Fiat/Chrysler to not offer the VVT Hemi and/or US EPA approved diesel - as a $2500 option to the Rubicon.
I think Dr Dieter Zetsche prevented the Wrangler from getting the Hemi and CRD because it would make the $35K Wrangler as good as their $100K G-Wagen (gotta protect your own first).
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